Articles & Podcast Episodes

Win More Customers By Providing The Ultimate Post Purchase Experience with Irina Poddubnaia

Think about the last time you placed an order on an e-commerce site. You get a confirmation email, and what’s in it? Usually, only shipping and fulfillment information.

Most online stores provide limited information and miss an excellent opportunity to upsell customers when they are not expecting to be up-sold.

Irina Poddubnaia tells us how her solution helps store owners maximize their transactional emails and turn them into marketing contact points.

Transcript

Brent: Welcome to Tak Commerce. Today I have Irina Pad. Please go ahead, introduce yourself. Pronounce your name the way it’s supposed to be pronounced. Tell us your day-to-day role and may be one of your passions in life. 

Irina: All right. Thank you Brent. My name is Irina Pad. I’m from Bulgaria and I’m the founder of Trackage Dot.

Irina: We help entrepreneurs with post-purchase customer experience. So basically everything that happens after the buy button is Preston in eCommerce store. And when it comes to passions right now it’s public speaking and everything that’s related speak, just speaking and speak and singing as well.

Irina: So that’s one of my passions right now. 

Brent: Oh, awesome. Are you gonna sing for us? . 

Irina: It depends. , we’ll do one thing here, . 

Brent: We’ll leave that, we’ll leave it right to the end. So I did warn you that I have a project called The Free Joke Project, and maybe we should, we could do the free song project next, but we’ll do the free Pro Joke project.

Brent: All I’m going to do is tell you a joke and you can tell me if that joke should be free or if it’s one that we could charge. And since you did mention singing, I found a joke that has at least some reference to singing in it. Here we go. Did you know Mortal Combat is based on an old Scandinavian church song?

Brent: It’s a Finn Hymn.

Irina: That’s a good one. I I don’t know about if you should charge for it, but that’s a good. 

Brent: All right I’ll just one more quick one. Why is Pavlov’s hair so soft? Because he conditions it. Yeah, I know. They’re all really bad. I apologize. All right. So wouldn’t say that 

Irina: they’re bad. I’m just saying that Yeah.

Irina: This is like the hi and intellectual humor. It’s not 

Brent: just like it’s only for sas. That’s, it has to be smart people. All right. So let’s talk about PO I, I’m very interested in post transactional data and how you can get people and we are a magenta agency. My day job is work running a magenta agency and we’ve done a lot of work where in the card after they check after they ac even after they pay.

Brent: We like sometimes would the customers would like to hold that transaction and get ’em to buy something more. So tell us a little bit about your. And how it helps people post transaction. 

Irina: So what we do is basically, so I can just start from the beginning. 

Irina: And why they do that, because the conversion is from five to 10% of extra sales just from looking at the order status. So we helped like we literally just took this functionality and made it available outside of Amazon. So you can plug it into your store. That’s built with Shopify Commerce.

Irina: Magenta is in the plans. We don’t have a direct. , but we do have an integration with Zapier. So it’s possible to pass the data. So what it creates is it creates a tracking page where customers can see additional products the actual information about where order and when it’s coming to them and also the brand and social media accounts and the delivery information, whatever you want to put on the page.

Irina: It’s 100% customiz. And you can change all the bits and pieces of it. So it’s a drag and drop builder where you can literally just customize everything. So one other thing that I didn’t mention is that also those pages, they have localization. So if a customer is from a different country or if you are shipping internationally you can just customize the page with specific language.

Irina: That’s that’s region. Because we support customized emails as well. So emails can be in their local language when the tracking page can be in local language. So the entire thing. So what Trackage does is we are helping the customers not only understand with the like the package is coming to them, but also to see additional products while we’re where.

Irina: Browsing for the information they were actually looking for. So that’s how we help e-commerce stores bridge the communication gap and also lower the customer support load because people don’t have to ask the the question, the fail the question, like, where is my order? Where is my package?

Irina: That overloads customer support and e-commerce, so they don’t have to ask because it’s already answered. . 

Brent: So tell us some numbers. Do you have some hard numbers that kind of show how successful this is in terms of, it brings a lift on post transactional purchases by 10% or 15 or whatever that number is?

Brent: Yeah. And then all the secondary part of that question is, do you rely on discounts or coupons or anything else to bring in or do people just buying. 

Irina: Okay. I can tell you about our numbers currently. First thing that we measured is the open rate for the post-purchase emails that talk about the status of the order.

Irina: So basically we’ve seen the open rates around 60%. So that’s way higher than any marketing emails that you. . Another thing is that like from those emails customers, they visit the tracking pages one or two times per day when they are actually actively waiting for the order. Instead of just going through the email every time they just save the link and they go and visit it one or two times.

Irina: So during that time various sliders so what we’ve seen that then the sliders were. The conversion rate wasn’t that high. It was around like four, 5%, like it was on the lower end, but when they made them animated and they started moving the conversion rate raised to around 12, 10, 10, 12%.

Irina: Customers were actually, when we are waiting for the order, they literally have nothing to do. And they want to get the package repair waiting. But they don’t know how to facilitate that process. So instead, they are li left with just some free time and they start browsing the product.

Irina: And if the products are interesting the customers are buying. So we’ve worked with this influencer. They are creating an animated series. And this katoon gathered a very passionate fan base with free million follow. . It’s called Metal Family. If you want, you can check it out.

Irina: Like very cooling. And they have remarkable sense of humor, , so I would say so, and this fan base they were like when they launched their first comic book they were not prepared to handle like the amount of orders they were going to get because they printed the whole batch of 10,000.

Irina: And it was sold instead of two months. How we were projecting it was sold in one week, and after that they had to fulfill everything and what they’ve seen. So from those 10,000 orders like originally, wasn’t there, but we joined in be middle of this process. So from those 10,000 orders we’ve seen around 7% extra sales.

Irina: So that result around like 700 or that’s exactly what it. And so 700 text orders from the tracking page directly, but then we don’t measure the indirect sales. Some of the customers we were going through the logo to the website, we were going through the social media and then back to the website.

Irina: So that’s like the indirect conversion. So maybe it’s around 15% or something like that because we didn’t have the detailed analytics at that point. And what happened then? , the customers were waiting and instead of writing to customer support like they previously did because metal family, they were overwhelmed with the amount of questions they got.

Irina: Because the customers, they were, again, you can imagine this is a Katoon series. What kind of immature customers were there? So very immature customers were sending messages to all the social media accounts. We knew five messages from one customer, like every. . So they had to ease that pain.

Irina: So we had to ease that pain for them because once the emails started get going out and people were getting proactive communication, they stopped asking the questions and the customer support just co I don’t know, side with relief because all that enormous I don’t know, like a ton of sta questions.

Irina: Like it just went. So after that happened and the last bit of functionality and what we also helped metal family with was getting reviews. So at the end of the purchasing experience when the customer actually gets the order they, they experience this I dunno, like burst of enden when they open the package and they finally see the thing that we ordered.

Irina: And it’s the perfect moment to ask for a review. Because in most cases with what I’ve seen with e-commerce stores, they use just timed automation. So in two weeks there is an email that goes out asking for review. But what if in two weeks your customer hasn’t received the order yet?

Irina: And that happened to me a couple of times when I ordered from China or sometime from us. Like it, literally, like it asked me for a review when I didn’t yet get the product and when I’m fighting with the customs to get it out of , outta the post office. The idea is, so what we did, we configured the automation, the standard one and it started asking for reviews and every fifth customer left the review around five stars.

Irina: So that was 2,150 reviews from 10,000. . That’s enormous, I would say. And those reviews they can be used on the product pages, on the, I mean on the store itself and on social media. So there are a lot of ways how you can capitalize on social proof. 

Brent: So the social is the, is that how you leverage other customers to bring in 

Irina: more customers?

Irina: Yes. And we have one feature that is like the killer feature, but it’s not yet. Then the customer review is four stars and more. I think we’re going to make it configurable so that you can adjust the threshold. So if review is positive we will ask the customer to share it on social media with reach media, for example like video or a photo of them interacting with the product.

Irina: So let’s going to probably get some sales from. I’ve seen some companies that were capitalizing just on oh, you were going to post review anyway. How about you get some like some money from the brand that you’re posting it for? So yeah, there are quite a few companies that are focusing on TikTok commerce.

Brent: Yeah. Are you focusing then on making are, so they get an email and then they go and open up the email to go to this, to, to the custom tracking page or? Custom tracking page that you’re generating automatically there right 

Irina: after checkout. The custom tracking page is going to be available the entire time how it’s set up like technically.

Irina: When the store signs up the trackage and they install one of the apps, or they just configuring integration with like the third party. . We will get the tracking page inside of Trackage and you can create multiple tracking pages. By the way if you are promoting different things or if you have different brands.

Irina: So you can configure tracking pages for every occasion. And the tracking page, it’s standalone. You can put it on your custom domain or you can use trackage domain and you can plug it in anywhere. It’s responsive, so on mobile and on desktop, which works seamlessly. The idea is that page is always there, but the content based on who is looking at that page changes.

Irina: So they can look by the order number or by the tracking number that they got. And if we don’t remember both, they can enter their email and they’re going to get an email from Trackage that’s going to send them their tracking page. So this way we. Just this is a security feature. Because if we were allowing them to just look up any email, that’s not a very secure 

Brent: feature.

Brent: Yeah, that makes sense. I’m interested in your own journey. In your bio that you moved to China without speaking Chinese, and you ran a fulfillment company and then you now. You’ve launched the SAS company remotely without any funding. Tell us a little bit about that journey.

Brent: Like how did you end up in China and then are you back in Bulgaria now? 

Irina: Yes. I’m back in Bulgaria for the last six years. And that journey to China, it started just by me feeling adventurous. I. Because at some point in my life I was just working in an office I was selling frozen berries in bulk.

Irina: So it wasn’t a very exciting job to tell you the, like to tell you the truth. And at that point I thought that I knew everything about commerce and how videos are done because I was selling the. , like ev, everything, like in trucks and even higher amounts. So we, we had never sold any ships, by the way, because that’s a lot but the trucks, yeah.

Irina: And I thought that I understood everything like with bills of lading how the deals are them, how to accept the payments, invoicing, everything. But that wasn’t, When they came to China we found the the variety of suppliers of everything you could imagine. There were literally plazas.

Irina: Those are skyscrapers of like full to the brim with goods of various kinds, like a plaza for smartphone accessories. That’s not an exaggeration where it is a whole city of like smartphone accessories. You could literally just find everything. What we realized at that point was that it’s not about the suppliers, it’s about the customers, because we didn’t have that many customers at that point.

Irina: When when we came to China and we found all the suppliers, we found how to work with them. We figured everything out. We still were forced to understand marketing, to reach out to customers, to do the prospecting selling, and that’s. and that’s how we were surviving. So we figured out the pay dads and it was the full experience because we had to survive based on how well the business performed.

Irina: We didn’t take any funding ever. We didn’t even know what was a possibility. That’s right. . So that’s how my like Chinese adventures came to an end when we lost one of our biggest customers. And then we felt like overwhelmed with all evaporations and like packaging the boxes. Because again, for two and a half years my main occupation was to go to a warehouse to accept the goods, to pack the goods, to ship it to the logistics company, to negotiate with suppliers check.

Irina: And I even stopped speaking English that much just because we were working with Europe and like it wasn’t necessary. And I, like all the time I was exposed to Chinese, so my English kind of went. . So yeah, at some point I realized that’s not what I want to do in life. I wasn’t born to package boxes.

Irina: That’s not something that I want to do. And that’s when this part of with Johnny ended and after that we moved back to Bulgaria. We. like we were. Yeah, at that point we were very discouraged because like we attempted to work, we attempted to create our own business. It wasn’t the next Amazon unfortunately, or even the next early express.

Irina: It wasn’t like. Yeah. And that’s when we realized that we could do something with the tools that we developed for ourselves while we were in. So everything from inventory, acceptance keeping track of all the shipments keeping track of all the orders and yeah, we just wanted to bring all the experience with Beca to a better cause and make it available for our e-commerce entrepreneurs to use.

Irina: So that’s how Trackage was born. And that’s how it’s still there . . 

Brent: Yeah. It’s interesting that a lot of these great there’s a lot of great tools that get developed in-house and then suddenly the entrepreneur who’s selling something realize that they have a great CRM or inventory management or whatever that tool is, that software tool, and suddenly they’ve decided their own, their old business is no good and here’s much better business.

Brent: Do you feel as though. Branching into a whole new culture helped you be more competitive. I just did working in China help you be a better entrepreneur when you went back to Bulgaria? 

Irina: You know what I definitely can say uh, happened is that I lost my like rose tinted glasses. So I started actually looking realistically at the world of business and.

Irina: it’s un like we, like at the beginning of a journey, we lost unfathomable amount of money. Like with just purchasing own goods or just, I dunno, like the logistics partner losing the packages and who knows what else. We experienced all the hardships of working with people that we didn’t know anything about.

Irina: And we didn’t have experience with all those different products that were ordered from us because we literally offered to buy anything from China, from us. And that’s that was probably a mistake right now I realize it was probably a mistake. We should have niche down. We should have just studied with niche, understood the quality requirements found with West suppliers, and then just scaled that.

Irina: But instead, we just went broad and developed the tools instead of developing the. . But again that’s a learning experience. I I will never say that. I’m not glad it happened. And after that I now realize how important that is to understand the customer before the supplier, because there are a lot of suppliers, but the customers, they are the backbone of a business.

Irina: And if you don’t have any sales, you don’t have a. That’s 

Brent: easy. One. One of my experiences with buying products from China is that documentation is often just Google translated. Do you find that same type of, did you find that, say I’m assuming you sold products to Bulgaria and it was maybe they put, they did a Google translate into Bul.

Brent: Into Bulgarian and nobody actually, no humid actually read. read the text. Is that something that is overlooked in China or is it something that that people just don’t think is important? I’m, and I’m just saying specifically language, like we, you get some products that are coming from China that are just translated into English, and it’s clear it was done through a machine.

Brent: It wasn’t nobody actually read it. Who’s an English? 

Irina: Yeah. In case of our deals I was translating everything, so that wasn’t the case. So yes, I did remember when we got some materials, they were very poorly translated. And I did have to, I did have to spend a lot of time to adjust, rewarding and to literally make something out of.

Irina: The cluster of words or keywords that I received as specification. So that was fixed by me, basically. And I remember how we were creating all the documents just because we were requirements of the customs, not because the suppliers provided them from the suppliers. We literally got big thank you and the goods

Irina: That’s all we got from it. So yeah I believe the problem literally exists. But I think with AI tools that are currently on the market, you can adjust that. And the translation tools were also getting better. Then we were in China communication was done just for the mobile phones.

Irina: We were writing in English and showing them some Chinese characters and they underst. I think right now it’s, it would be through Google Speech or something like I’m going to talk to the tool I dunno, Skype maybe. They introduced some on the fly translation. So I think right now it’s much easier to communicate anywhere in the world.

Irina: But at that point it was challenging. 

Brent: So your experience coming outta China and then into Track Ma and. I know one thing you’ve said about Trackage is it helps the merchant put their store more on autopilot. Just can you explain how it, how that works and how it, I know you’ve said that there’s less customer service involved, but it can’t always be a hundred percent autopilot.

Irina: That’s why we’re not saying that 100% of customer support requests are going to be automated because if the customer has a question about the size chart or about the customs clearance or something like something was shipped to wrong location, you still need to have customer support and you need to reply to those customers.

Irina: But all the repetitive questions, the ones that can be answered by robots, Like the, where is my order? The limo request. That that one can definitely be automated. And with automation, literally, nobody’s going to ask you that question because it’s not going to be an issue for the customer.

Irina: They are already going to know when, like, when the order is coming, where is it where is it coming from? I know what carrier it’s shipped through. And also they will have information about the delivery, very funds, whatever information you want to put on the tracking page because the more information you give to your customers will less likely they are going to reach out.

Irina: Whereas some illiterate people who are still going to go to customer support and ask a question, I I totally understand that there is going to be a percentage of people who are still going to not understand what’s going. But that percentage is going to be minuscule compared to the previous amount.

Irina: So that’s just like the customer support side. A lot of automation is also coming from operation side. So for example, with chi, with Chinese suppliers we had to deal with this interesting situation where the supplier is providing you with a tracking number or the information about the.

Irina: But then the tracking number doesn’t have any tracking information, so that means the tracking number is either incorrect or the product has not been shipped. And if for example, this situation is left unattended for a week or two, the customer is going to get anxious, we are going to start asking for very money back.

Irina: So we had to monitor all of that. And that’s how in Trackage we have two counters. They is an idle and they in. So days in I is counting until the package is actually moving. So until the status in transit appears on the package. And the other one days in transit is counting how many days it’s in transit whatever the package got lost in the post.

Irina: So this way the business can proactively reach out to those customers who were unfortunate enough to experience a deliver. And if it’s in the initial stage of communication with the supplier, they can reach out to the supplier and ask like, where is the package, when they’re going to ship it?

Irina: And if a supplier is unresponsive for where is an issue, they can even refund it and find an our supplier to buy product from. That’s specifically handy for a drop shipps for hours. It’s not we handy, but still you can poke your suppliers or even knock at where doors and. what package it should have been shipped three days ago.

Irina: What’s going on? 

Brent: Yeah, a really good point. A lot of ERPs will generate a tracking. They’ll generate, the package has been shipped even before it gets to the post office, or UPS picks it up and UPS doesn’t assign a tracking number until they’ve actually taken possession of the package.

Brent: So that’s a great feature right now, yeah. And if you were to offer some, bit of advice to a merchant going into the holidays right now what could they still do and what should they be doing after the holidays? 

Irina: The holiday season is rather challenging for commerce, so it just literally creates an overload of shipments and overload of everything like processing.

Irina: So I guess , my, like most straightforward advice ladies keep saying keep calm , because this is going to pass, but right now you need to operate at 100% efficiency, 100% capacity. So I guess that’s so that’s wise. But after the holiday season is. You can examine and do some postmortems for some of the problems that you experienced during the holiday season.

Irina: You can see which carriers failed which carriers you might want to replace with an alternative one. . I know that on social media, there are quite a few people who are talking about diversifying the shipment volume between not just FedEx, u Ps like the like the two major carriers.

Irina: You could try our ones and see if this improves your cost per shipment or the cost like the overall margin as well. So another thing would be to evaluate your customer support after the. And see where the customer support might have failed or might have failed the communication with the customers.

Irina: Because usually during holidays people want to buy presents and if they become very sensitive to the timelines of a shipment. So if a person is not going to get their Christmas socks, for example, we’re going to be very upset. And the customer support needs to handle that and be mentally prepared that we are going to be customers with delayed.

Irina: Yeah. And the most interesting part would be to evaluate your systems overall. So once the holiday season is over, once you see over weak points where the systems are not working as you expected them to, you can definitely I dunno. Start evaluating which systems are lacking in your tech stack.

Irina: Maybe tech majors lacking Yeah. Something of a similar fashion where you can see all the orders and all evaporations on one page and understand where you are still not efficient enough. So just basically do the fine tuning when it’s below season in January or in February.

Irina: It’s the best time. Start implementing some new changes because during the holiday season, you will not have the opportunity to do that. 

Brent: Yeah that’s really good advice. Never make changes during the holidays or after October, maybe. code lockdown for people who do on-prem software. Irina. When we close out the podcast, I give everybody a chance to do a shameless plug about anything you’d like.

Brent: What would you like to plug? 

Irina: All right. I would like to gift the listeners of top Commerce Podcast the free resource. It’s called How to Get five to 10% Extra Sales from existing Customers without spending more money on ads or hiring more staff. In this book you can see like all the key ingredients for creating the best post-purchase experience for your customer.

Irina: And definitely you will understand what things are lacking in your current post-purchase experience. And you can either implement them yourself or maybe use Trackage for that purpose. Yeah. And you can find it at trackage.com, slash flywheel dash extra sales. And I hope that in the show notes you can also find.

Irina: . Yeah. 

Brent: Yeah. I’ll put all those I’ll put all the, all your links in the show notes how they can get in contact with you and and and of course track ma.com. Thank you, ARITA. Thank you so much for being here. It’s been such a pleasure. Thank you for staying up late. And thank you.

Brent: It’s my pleasure.

Irina: I love talking about e-commerce and what you can improve in your supply chain and post-purchase experience. Thank you for the opportunity.

Thank you to Podcagent for the wonderful guest!

What is Shopware

Shopware is a powerful, On-Prem (Self-Hosted), PaaS, and SaaS cloud-based ecommerce platform designed to help businesses build and grow their online stores.

Looking Forward in Finance with Alejandra Santos

Have you ever wondered what the difference is between an accountant and a finance person?

An accountant looks backward, and a finance person looks forward.

Alejandro Santos helps us to understand the complexities and the simplicities in accounting, why you should be looking forward more than you should be looking backward, and how vital that finance person is in your organization.

Transcript

[00:02:46] Brent: Welcome to this episode of Talk Commerce. Today I have Alejandra Santos. Alejandra is the c e o and founder of Startup Tandem. Alejandra, go ahead, do an introduction better than I just did. Maybe tell us your day-to-day role in one of your passions in life. 

[00:03:03] Alejandra: Oh, thank you so much Brent, for the introduction and for having me here.

[00:03:06] Alejandra: I am very excited for today’s episode. So my day-to-day means a lot of meetings, talking to clients and steering them into good practices with their financial. And with the finances in their business, and taking long walks along the beach with my dog and , trying, if I have the opportunity to take a meeting to the beach, I will absolutely do that as well.

[00:03:27] Alejandra: And a passion of mine. I just, I have so many, but I’m gonna say since we’re talking about dogs, passion is to rescue all the ducks from the streets and put them in beautiful homes. . 

[00:03:36] Brent: That’s a, that is a great, that’s a great venture to do. All right, so Alejandra, I did warn you that I’m going to do this free joke project.

[00:03:43] Brent: I’m gonna tell you a joke and you could just tell me if you feel as though the joke should be continue to be free, or if you feel like we could charge for the joke at some point. Okay. Here we go. Never date a tennis player. Love means nothing to.

[00:04:01] Alejandra: I think that one’s free. Okay, , 

[00:04:04] Brent: thanks. Thank you so much. All right, so Startup Tandem. Tell us a little bit about how you started Startup Tandem, and why you started it. 

[00:04:13] Alejandra: Yeah, so thank you for that brand. Startup tandem. I’ve been doing accounting and finance for 15 plus years. I actually bred into it after I gra I graduated college, I did the wealth management, and then I went into corporations, big companies, nonprofits, and it was when I moved to California that I went into entrepreneurship as an employee.

[00:04:32] Alejandra: Internal employee is an external consultant working for. One of the competitors, not what it is now, a competitor of mine. And it was there that I realized a big gap that existed between the services that were provided, two entrepreneurs when they were building their businesses to exactly what, the price was for those services.

[00:04:50] Alejandra: And it just didn’t make any sense to me. So that’s why I created Startup Tandem. A startup Tandem is a supportive partner of four entrepreneurs in when they’re in their. To start a business and as a startups and all the growth level, that maturity, some clients are making 80 million in revenue.

[00:05:07] Alejandra: Some other ones are making one $50,000 in gross revenue. It just, it really doesn’t matter where you are in your journey. We are committed to become that partner that can set you up at least with a good infrastructure and take you all the way until you scale or until you’re ready to hire internally. So that’s exactly what we do.

[00:05:23] Alejandra: We set up entrepreneurs with the tools and the resources. to help them in their finance journey and not just, give them whatever service. It’s not a one size fits all. It’s customized to its company’s growth. 

[00:05:35] Brent: When you start with an entrepreneur or a new business, do you see them making common mistakes in, in, in their accounting practices or bookkeeping, things like 

[00:05:44] Alejandra: that?

[00:05:45] Alejandra: A hundred percent. So one of the biggest pitfalls that I see is that they’re not on top of, Just general bookkeeping. And they don’t have really good policies in place. By that means that there’s no AR policy or AP PO policy approval policies in place. There’s a lot of personal expenses go flowing through the company.

[00:06:03] Alejandra: And, They do their taxation, their taxes according to their bank statements rather than a financial statement. And it’s not really until they have the urge to bring an external investor, an external partner, or they’re trying to get into a very big line of credit or some kind of debt financing that actually puts them urgency.

[00:06:22] Alejandra: To, wow, I gotta clean my financials now because we’re gonna look at that. And at that time, at that moment, you’re really 10 years into the business or five years into the business, and you’re looking at a high cost. Just to go there backwards and then forward to clean those financials is a big mess and it takes a lot of money out of your pocket.

[00:06:42] Brent: Do you find that a lot of entrepreneurs aren’t necessarily versed in accounting and maybe they don’t underst. what payables are and what receivables are and even the sense that, hey, I’m suddenly, I’m amount of money, but I have a whole bunch of inventory to you. Help them with some of those 

[00:06:58] Alejandra: pieces.

[00:06:59] Alejandra: Oh, 100%. And yes, what we do, a big portion of what we do with our marketing and resources that we offer is education. Just because that is a thing that we do see in the industry. There is no urgency in. in financials, in financial management, in accounting, and knowing what your numbers are. So a lot of it goes with educational videos, educational resources, why you should do it, why it works, why you should, this is a big component of your business.

[00:07:27] Alejandra: We. Definitely focus on that as an early stage company. Even though you cannot afford, if you cannot afford a full service yourself, we definitely wanna set you up with the tools and infrastructure, the policies to help you get into a good regimen. And, if you wanna do it yourself, you can, do it yourself, but at least you have something to go buy.

[00:07:47] Alejandra: And then when it comes to inventory, that’s a big pitfall that I see, especially for e-commerce companies, startups, and businesses, is. They don’t have just with the basics, they don’t have a really good skew numbing clutcher. Which that means it’s like products. Some products don’t even have a skew, so it’s really hard to even track down what the levels of that skew is or that inventory product is if you don’t even have a good traceability on it.

[00:08:11] Alejandra: So yeah, there is a lot of things that I see pitfalls, but there is a lot of things that also systems and very low budget resources and tools can. Entrepreneurs gear to the right position. 

[00:08:24] Brent: You see a lot of entrepreneurs doing books or doing their bookkeeping as the last thing they wanna worry about, they just get it done.

[00:08:32] Brent: And I, you had mentioned that they just go off bank statements for reconciling they’re not doing cash flow reports and there’s so many more things that are involved in there. How do you educate ’em on some of those? . 

[00:08:42] Alejandra: So yeah, it’s really interesting. I get a lot of clients at the end of the year because they’re getting ready for tax season, and one of the big things that I get is, oh my God, my books are a mess.

[00:08:52] Alejandra: I don’t even have a set of accounts. Can you please help me out? Cuz the tax season is coming. And it’s great. Yes, we can definitely do that. However, When I asked them those questions that you just did, okay, so what is your cash burn? What is the biggest driver of your cash burn? What, those are the things that you have to know in order to make the right strategic decisions in your business.

[00:09:11] Alejandra: You gotta know all those drivers. You gotta know all those KPIs. So when I make those questions to them, it’s it goes like an. in the brain. Oof. Okay. I don’t know those things. Maybe I should know them. Yes, abso a hundred percent. And I try to get because in numbers it’s not for everybody, and especially when you are a business owner and you’re creating this amazing product, you’re very creative. You probably don’t wanna talk numbers. So when you’re very creative, I try to talk, in the level. Whoever is in front of me to educate them, okay, maybe you do need to know what’s causing that burn, because if you know that you can control that, you could probably put that money into this instead.

[00:09:50] Alejandra: Product development or a marketing expense, something that’s gonna drive revenue up, and that’s when they realize, okay, I do need to be more diligent with my financials. 

[00:10:02] Brent: are some, are there some basic from an educational standpoint that you help them with and say just in reporting balance sheet, p and l, cash flow statement, are there some just basics that every entrepreneur should know before they even start?

[00:10:15] Alejandra: Before they even start? Yeah, that’s a good one. . I even have friends that entrepreneurs, and I tell them all the time, get your stuff together before, please don’t give it to me like that. The first thing I say is try treat your business as a business. And your personal is your personal business.

[00:10:28] Alejandra: A business is basic. Don’t run your. Personal expenses through the business is just at the end of the day, you gotta look at the big picture. And if the big picture is, I’m gonna sell my company in five, six years, guess what? They’re gonna be looking at those ebitda. They’re gonna look at operational income and they’re gonna see what’s flowing down there.

[00:10:46] Alejandra: And if you put all their personal expenses flowing, it’s gonna destroy the valuation of your company. So I try, just keep the big picture, even if you don’t understand the technicality of it, just keep the big picture in mind as soon as you have a business. Go with the, goal. I’m gonna sell my business.

[00:11:01] Alejandra: I’m gonna go an I P O, and then work towards that since the beginning, from the beginning. And just that will give you a clear sense of what you should or should not do. And if you have a hesitation, then ask questions to someone that does. No 

[00:11:14] Brent: I think you mentioned how the banking system works and how they wanna look at your books.

[00:11:20] Brent: If you are gonna start, if you’re gonna try to get a loan it would also apply to, if you wanna sell your business or get investors how do you recommend somebody that maybe they’ve been in business for five, six years and suddenly they’re, they want to start making their books, is it a process to weed through the mess that a person may have made and then they, you need to get ’em on the, in the right.

[00:11:43] Alejandra: Yeah. So there is definitely a process, especially if you have been in business for a few years and you have done taxes according to your bank statements rather than what’s sitting on that, on those financials. There is definitely a process, especially because those years are already closed.

[00:11:57] Alejandra: I called them closed because. Taxes have been already filed. So it’s really how can I say? You have to talk to the person that file your taxes to, to see what kind of adjustments you have to put in those financials to match exactly what you did in your taxes. And let’s just say that most of the time, your taxes, the taxes that are done are show less revenue.

[00:12:15] Alejandra: Then what’s in the financials? And it’s just because it’s cash basis and there’s a lot more things that are happening on the financials that are happening in, the bank statements. Let’s just say that it’s, you have to go retroactively. So what we do is basically Reno talk to the tax attorney or tax prison that did those books and say, okay, this is where we are.

[00:12:35] Alejandra: this is a trial balance. Now what can we do to get it there and then go forward cleaning up the whole, financial set and make sure that everything that’s flushed out personal, from business is flushed out and there’s a differentiation on it. Because what happens is the banks will look at least two to three years, depending on the financial institution.

[00:12:55] Alejandra: To see, what, how much your gross revenue is. You’re gonna look at those numbers. So if we can make the financials as accurate as possible, and related to what was posted on the taxes and then moving forward as well, we can show some growth, then that can put in a better place, and that goes with investors as well.

[00:13:14] Alejandra: The same, they’re gonna ask for your, your financials. Most you don’t, you probably don’t wanna even share your tax return if it’s flowing through you with an investor it’s uncomfortable situation. So we would have to go back, clean it up, match it to that, and then go forward and show some kind of forecasting, increase in revenue.

[00:13:33] Brent: Yeah, I think that you brought up a really good point about how the tax how the bank statements won’t reflect your ar They won’t reflect your inventory, they wouldn’t reflect any depreciable assets that you have and how important those are for a business owner to know. And even for when you’re going to get a loan, the banker’s gonna want to know what your assets are outside of what the bank balance.

[00:13:56] Brent: maybe talk about some of those pitfalls that entrepreneurs fall into when they, maybe they’re not as educated around accounting as they should be. 

[00:14:05] Alejandra: Yeah, so that’s actually a good point, Brent. So there’s a lot of asset based financing and it’s very important to know that, especially if you are in e-commerce and you have inventory on the books So there is definitely platforms.

[00:14:18] Alejandra: I’m just gonna speak very, a few of them. I don’t endorse any of them by the way. There is a Shopify, there is PayPal capital there is Clear Bank. Those right there will finance against your cashflow revenue stream. But what some asset based institutions do, and you can do the traditional or the non-traditional way, which.

[00:14:37] Alejandra: Do you prefer the non-traditional way for small companies or startups because they’re a little bit riskier? They basically look at your inventory and see what the inventory turnover is and see exactly what the valuation on that in turnover is to finance against it. And what happens there is that if you don’t have.

[00:14:54] Alejandra: If you don’t have a clear, a clean inventory balance, meaning they’re gonna ask for warehouse reports, they’re gonna ask for, what’s sitting on the balance sheet ties into the warehouse and evaluation that’s sitting in the warehouse. Actually the same as in the books. And if you don’t have that really button up, you’re missing on a lot of money.

[00:15:12] Alejandra: And if you do get an untraditional institution, they, you’re probably missing on not right now, cuz there’s inflation. In the future you probably will be missing on lower, in a low cost of capital financing rather than going to a traditional institution. When they give you a term loan, which is gonna be really high with really bad.

[00:15:29] Alejandra: Payment terms. So there is a lot to unpack when it comes to the balance sheet financing. There’s your ar like if you have some really good contracts and clients and they’re valued at, let’s just put a number, 500,000. You can get some really good financing against that if you find a good institution that can give you good factor for that.

[00:15:47] Brent: On your website you list that you do services like bookkeeping and fractional cfo. Maybe explain to our listeners some of the differences, and if we started with the bookkeeper, you have a comptroller, there’s a fractional cfo, there’s a cpa. How there’s a lot of different roles that that a in financials that play.

[00:16:06] Brent: Tell us if you could just explain some of those differences and then maybe tell us what, how you help. Yeah, 

[00:16:13] Alejandra: no, thank you. So yeah, so bookkeeping is your, I’m gonna call like the very low level service. Very basic, can somebody coming in, making sure that your bills are there, your invoices are there, your payments are matching, your invoices very low level.

[00:16:28] Alejandra: I don’t like to really just offer that because I think the company does deserve a little bit more. Than just bookkeeping. I like the accounting, the whole accounting service for anybody honest. It doesn’t matter what your business growth is. And it’s because it not only makes sure that your books ar and AP are really up to par, but it’s also gives a little bit more insight on what your margins are and where you know, your, where your biggest drivers of expenses are.

[00:16:56] Alejandra: If it’s marketing or you. Probations or whichever one it is. So I like that one more. And each level, for us at least, we do have a CPA person and management, that manages the accounts and make sure that everything is up to par. We do have also staff and senior accountants that take care of the very.

[00:17:16] Alejandra: Low, low, the low budget task as well. And then when it comes to fractional, CFO is going forward, right? So one of the things that people need to understand is that accounting is, keeping the financials accurate to what’s going on right now. But cfo, f o means going forward. But in order to have a good forward overlook, you are gonna need accurate financials like the forward.

[00:17:40] Alejandra: journey is based on the actuality right now. A CFO person is somebody that will do those analysis for you, is gonna do an f p, and a analysis is gonna do a weekly cash flow. It’s gonna do some variance analysis, which is like budgets, forecast versus actuals, right? Where are you standing according to your forecast or your budget?

[00:17:59] Alejandra: And if we have to readjust the forecast to meet those numbers this person will help you navigate. What kind of KPIs you’re gonna need to reach, or what kind of KPIs you need in order to meet certain metrics or something like revenue goals. This person can identify, like I said, cash burn.

[00:18:16] Alejandra: Where is that cash burn coming from? If you are a company that’s bringing product from China or bringing, product from another country, what are your shipping costs? Is that like the main driver of your cash burn? What can we. To mitigate that cash burn. And it’s somebody that, when it comes to financial institutions, goes ahead and assess the risk of each loan or line of credit or any, o other kind of tool that you wanna get into.

[00:18:40] Alejandra: This is a person that will analyze and assess that risk that comes with it. And it’s a true apr, right? What exactly are the fees that my company’s gonna face on a yearly basis? Divide business with this company. It’s just, for all, anything that you need. There is, like I said, accounting is actual.

[00:18:55] Alejandra: So you need somebody that can make sure that every number in that book is actually, has a backup. If there’s traceability, there’s an a report. If somebody comes looking for answers, there’s something there. And then you, a fractional CFO is somebody going forward. How do we get to the next level?

[00:19:11] Brent: If somebody’s just starting let’s and they want, they, A year’s worth of books or two years worth of books, they’ve just done it on their own. How long would you expect somebody, like one of your team members to get them up to speed where it’s ready to. Start forecasting revenue, start for forecasting cash flow, things like 

[00:19:30] Alejandra: that.

[00:19:30] Alejandra: So it really depends. Let’s see, one year, two years, and they’ve done it all on their own. We would have to go and look at those books, make sure that, if there are any changes that we need to make. We do them in the current year. Talk to the tax accountant, like I said. And just honestly it takes a month or so to get the, to get us up to speed on like the accounting side.

[00:19:50] Alejandra: And then after that, because we need actual information, we need some really good, reliable information to do the forecasting. And then I would say like a few weeks after that, three weeks, we could probably have a model ready. We do models. Very differently than a lot of companies that I’ve worked for before.

[00:20:06] Alejandra: We don’t have a one size fits all kind of issue because everybody has, different business models and not also a different business growth as well. So there’s a lot of things that small companies don’t need and they probably find overwhelming. So we basically have standardized models already.

[00:20:23] Alejandra: We have a small model and we have a more complex model, and we adjust those models accordingly to the business. The, The business and the business model that we have. So with that being said, it doesn’t take as long to, to create something. But it does what could be that time delay would be the cleaning of the accounting and make sure that everything is reliable.

[00:20:45] Brent: What do you see from a mistake standpoint that entrepreneurs or business owners make when they are hiring somebody like you? and they want to try to cut costs at the same time. Is there places where you see people being cheap and maybe they should just spend the extra money on services to make sure that their books are right?

[00:21:07] Alejandra: Yeah, so I’ve seen different cases, so I’ve seen people. Hire full staff of marketing internal team, and overhead is one of those things that is the biggest driver of cost, especially for a small business. It’s one of the things that I look at. The first things that I look at are, do you have an office?

[00:21:26] Alejandra: How much are you paying for that? And how much people do you have in staff? Because you will be surprised. Fractional goes a long way when it comes to building a business. You just have to find the right partner. That’s what it goes with, everything, right? You just have to talk to people. getting a conversation.

[00:21:42] Alejandra: Go have coffee, vet them out, talk to their clients, talk to their partners, see how they’re reacting. But that would be one of the biggest pitfalls that I see is that these companies are spending a lot of money on employees, internal employees. With that comes and I don’t. Know if a lot of people are listening are in California, but if you are in California’s one of the worst states to have employees.

[00:22:04] Alejandra: It’s like the state is against you as an employer. There’s so many policies that you have to follow. It’s insane. So you could. , you could reduce that level of stress if you just go, find some agency or someone that does those services on the side and can be a good partner to you. The other one that I see is, like I said, if you are in e-commerce and you’re doing inventory is inventory wow.

[00:22:27] Alejandra: There is a, if you’ve. Find the wrong three PL company. Oh my goodness. There’s so much cost that goes with that. It’s just, and it’s a lot of cost to get out of it through PL and to get into another one. So research on the right three PL company is one of the biggest ones that I would suggest to do as well.

[00:22:44] Brent: As a business owner, do you recommend like a payroll service or do you recommend that the entrepreneur or business owner do their own? . 

[00:22:52] Alejandra: Oh, that’s a good one. So definitely a service, a payroll service. I honestly, I like everything. I’m not very techy. I like everything that’s very user friendly, user interface friendly to me.

[00:23:03] Alejandra: And I like the ones that are targeting startups because, they basically provide a lot of support and that companies do need and they’re not very bureaucratic, like older. Payroll software providers are but I’m not, I’m not here to recommend anything. But one of the big, one of the ones that we use is Gusto is very user-friendly.

[00:23:22] Alejandra: It connects with different softwares. And then I also hear that ADPs going and. Connecting, doing a thing with QuickBooks coming up soon. So that’s, that could be a good one as well. I just think that when you’re starting a company, you wanna be very e easy, make your life easy with a lot of techno technology tools, cuz it gets really complicated when you have so many at the same time.

[00:23:42] Brent: Is there a, is there an alternative to QuickBooks 

[00:23:44] Alejandra: as a small business? Oh my God, there is. There is, but is, you’ll be surprised how many people use QuickBooks. I think 90% of the population, I use QuickBooks, so there is, but QuickBooks is just makes it easy for small business owners because it’s very cost efficient, and for example, there’s NetSuite, NetID is a really good platform. , but it’s expensive. And that’s what I am saying, and they do have an in inventory management already capability in it, which makes it a fully RRP system. However, it is very costly, and this is when as a business owner, you have to make those decisions.

[00:24:21] Alejandra: It’s What is the value added for the software that I will be buying is if I’m spending $30,000 a year for the software, what is the value that I’m getting out of it? How many employees do I have that are you gonna be using it? And then from there determine if this is worth the investment or not.

[00:24:37] Alejandra: So that’s where we go with the companies that’s. Probably use QuickBooks online because it’s very cost efficient. You can connect it with other tools, but there’s ma As you grow your business, I, if it makes sense, go for it. If it doesn’t make sense to put those 20, 30 grand in a system, then don’t go for it.

[00:24:55] Alejandra: Just continue, using tools that work for you. 

[00:24:59] Brent: Is there, can you highlight challenges? So you mentioned e-commerce in selling a product. Is there challenges in selling a service as a, as a. . 

[00:25:08] Alejandra: Oh, always. There’s always challenges. . Oh my goodness. There’s so many challenges. Yes. One of the biggest challenges, it is credibility.

[00:25:15] Alejandra: Making sure, obviously when you’re, when I see it from a small business owner point of view, when you is your baby, Especially the finances. This is go to finances. Oh wow, somebody’s gonna handle my finances. You wanna make sure this person is really vetted and wonder what they’re speaking to.

[00:25:31] Alejandra: And I a hundred percent agree with that. Also marketing service is another one. That is, there’s presents a lot of challenges because marketing’s all about results. It’s not about the process. While the finance and the accounting is all about the process. , about the results.

[00:25:43] Alejandra: So you just have to, it is always, there’s always a challenge no matter what you sell. For me, the biggest challenge is people like me, they talk to me, they meet me, they’re like, oh she’s very pleasant. But I look very young. I’m not gonna lie. You’re looking at me right now.

[00:25:56] Alejandra: I look very young and people are like, oh my gosh. She has that much experience. How old was she when she graduated high school? And when they look at my experie, My experience will talk for itself. So if you do feel like there is a way to vet more of your service, providers, you can always ask for references for clients, for partners, for, just to see what they’re doing for other people.

[00:26:18] Alejandra: And, at the end of the day is, find a partner that has flexibility as well. on a contract. If you don’t like them, goodbye, there’s no oh my God, you, I have to pay this. I have to do that. I have no, it has to be somebody that’s easy because at the end of the day, you’re is your business and you wanna make sure you have the right partners in place.

[00:26:36] Brent: If you had a piece of advice going into this fourth quarter in these high interest rate times to a business owner, what would that be? 

[00:26:44] Alejandra: Start looking to cut costs. Right Now, look at the areas of like I, we just talked a few about overhead costs, right? Unfortunately there is a lot of people being laid off right now because of that reason.

[00:26:55] Alejandra: But. It shouldn’t be that way if you were vetting your costs at an early, earlier time this year, right? Because inflation has been coming for a long time already. So just be proactive look ahead. That would be my first advice. Look ahead, look at your cash burn. Start looking into those weekly cash flow models that I always, you know, monthly cash flow models will tell you so much, but if you look at a weekly standpoint and see exactly what’s driving the number in, you will see there is a lot of areas that you can, lower down those costs.

[00:27:23] Alejandra: The other one is, it was probably better back a few months ago to get into a line of credit, Kind of use that money now, the interest rate are so high, I don’t even recommend it. Just start initiating those conversations with a lot of financial institutions to see what they offer in the near future.

[00:27:42] Alejandra: Because the, the interest rates will come down. It’s, as the government continues to push, they will come down at some point. So the cost of capital will, will become cheaper. Just start initiating those conversations now and be, prepare, be proactive in this time. 

[00:27:56] Brent: Yeah, I’ve always heard that the best time to ask for cash from a bank is when you don’t need it at all.

[00:28:02] Brent: Exactly. , when you absolutely need it, that’s when they don’t want to give it to you. . Yeah. You, you mentioned weekly and monthly cash flow models and that’s how you can help cut expenses. Do you, so you recommend looking at the detail within that cash flow to help you see where that money’s going?

[00:28:15] Alejandra: Yeah. So this is the thing with the monthly one. So the monthly is a very undirect cash flow model. It takes the activity of the balance. Just to see what’s happening. But on a weekly basis, it is very direct. And you can monitor that on a weekly basis. Just to assess where you standing and when is It tells you by week when your cash is running out.

[00:28:34] Alejandra: If you’re running out of cash on January 3rd, that’s when you’re running out of cash with everything else that you’re being forecast, you’re meeting those forecast numbers and it helps you be proactive in your budget If you say, okay, I’m running out of cash on January 3rd. , that’s not a lot of runway.

[00:28:49] Alejandra: We don’t have, external capital coming. Let’s cut down what are the budget areas that we can minimize to bring it to February, at least one more month. That it helps you be really proactive in identifying those areas of opportunity. And then if you need to ask, do a fundraising round, then it gives you at least that lag time.

[00:29:08] Alejandra: Okay, two more months to get really out there and ask for. 

[00:29:13] Brent: Perfect. Alejandra, as we close up the podcast, I give the guests a chance to do a shameless plug about anything you’d like. What would you like to plug today? 

[00:29:20] Alejandra: It is Black Friday coming up, so make sure that you have your inventory.

[00:29:27] Alejandra: If you’re using something like Shopify or e-commerce, make sure your inventories are set up correctly cuz that way you don’t have a future headaches in the, once everything is done, make sure that you have your follow ups correct, coming out to all those new customers, make sure that you have some retained strategy for the new customers coming in and purchasing your product.

[00:29:46] Alejandra: So I would just say there’s actually a blog from OK Kendo I can share it with you and I just head over. There is a few tips of coming from different experts on how to prepare for Black Friday, cyber Monday for you to make a lot of money and cut a lot of headaches. . 

[00:30:01] Brent: That’s awesome. Yeah, I appreciate that.

[00:30:03] Brent: We don’t often get different types of industries that you’re giving advice for. Thank you so much for that. Alejandro Sandro, Santo, sorry. is the CEO and founder of Startup Tandem. Thank you so much for being here today. 

[00:30:17] Alejandra: Thank you brand. This was so much fun. Mutual Gusto, .

Thank you for making it to the end of this episode of Talk Commerce. Please rate this episode wherever you download your podcast. We are actively looking for people to participate in the Free Joke Project. Go to talk hyphen commerce.com and sign up for your free spot on the Free Joke Project. If you are a business, I will do a 32nd elevator.

In the spot to help promote your business. That’s talk hyphen commerce.com.

An Entrepreneurial Journey in Comic Books and Toilets with Alex Teller

Magento’s life as an ecommerce solution has been a roller coaster ride.

Alex Teller is more excited about the future of the platform than ever. Alex talks about the flexibility of Magento and how it powered his business for over a decade. He dives into marketing and social media topics and more.

Transcript

[00:03:00] Brent: Welcome to this magenta edition of Talk Commerce. Today I have Alex Teller. Alex is the CEO O of home. Perfect. Alex, go ahead, introduce yourself. Tell us your day-to-day role and maybe one of your passions in 

[00:03:13] Alex: life. Yep. My name is Alex Teller. I am the CEO O of Home. Perfect. We sell faucets and sinks brand name, luxury products.

[00:03:21] Alex: We’ve been in business for about 10. Business is on Magenta. I’ve been a magenta enthusiast for quite some time. And when I’m not in front of the computer breaking my head, trying to fix stuff, I like to collect old comic books. 

[00:03:36] Brent: Yeah. And I, we both met at Meet Magenta, New York and that was fascinating cuz my first experience in mag.

[00:03:43] Brent: With a client was on a comic book site and I can’t even remember the name now, but it’s been like 12 years. , you don’t remember the name? I know it’s not terrible. Yeah, that’s terrible. Anyways. did. I will look for it after the show and if I can find it, I’ll even put a link on the episode notes.

[00:03:58] Brent: So before we get into this what we’re gonna talk about, I do have an important project called the Free Joke Project. It’s hashtag free joke project. And I was, I’m gonna tell a joke to Alex. All I would like is just a reaction. The idea is, should these jokes be open source or are they like paywall?

[00:04:17] Brent: Okay, so they’re very short. Here we go. 

[00:04:20] Brent: Dude. I know. Geez. Yeah. Maybe we should open source. 

[00:04:23] Alex: This should be open source and patched and fixed for a decade. Before it’s stable, 

[00:04:27] Brent: we’re gonna have to do two.

[00:04:28] Brent: Now I’m gonna re, I’m gonna start, I’m gonna do my second joke. Ready. A ghost walks into a bar. The bartender says, sorry, we don’t serve spirits.

[00:04:40] Alex: That’s so 

[00:04:40] Brent: stupid. Yes. Very stupid

[00:04:45] Brent: All right. All right,

[00:04:50] Brent: I appreciate that. You gotta pay for a joke. That good? Yes. All right. So redo on the first one. The adjective from metal is metallic, but not so for iron, which is ironic.

[00:05:02] Brent: Yeah, I don’t know about that one. Yeah. Good thing I screwed it up to start with, but I feel 

[00:05:05] Alex: bad cuz it’s cuz the, I don’t know about that is like saying, oh, that should be open source. But I love 

[00:05:10] Brent: open source. Yeah. All right, good. I apologize. I could get a 

[00:05:13] Alex: tattoo. I would get the canoe public license across my back.

[00:05:17] Brent: There you go. Perfect. Yeah. Open source license 3.0. So yeah. Yeah. Alex, tell us a little bit about your journey. Commerce and how you started home. Perfect. 

[00:05:29] Alex: Yeah. I was always buying and selling on eBay. I would say eBay is my favorite to this day, still my favorite website ever. Because I do enjoy a, I do always have a collectible sort of nature to me.

[00:05:40] Alex: So I was buying, selling on eBay, and back then it might have been, I think I was like selling package software or DVDs. It, it was a while ago. It I’ve been buying and selling on eBay for so long that I was getting checks in the mail and I wasn’t even old enough to get a bank account. My parents needed to go in and sign me up so I could go deposit the checks and then PayPal came out and it was a game changer for me as I, I started to, just get the money straight to.

[00:06:07] Alex: So I was buying and selling on eBay, and then I knew I wanted to get into more e-commerce. And my father’s an architect and he put me in touch with some people that had access to some faucets and some sinks, and we hit the ground running and we’ve been in business ever since. . That’s 

[00:06:23] Brent: awesome.

[00:06:23] Brent: And so you got, you went from eBay to e-commerce? I know my wife had a business on eBay for a long time and a different type of business. So what, tell, just tell a little bit about what were you selling on eBay and how 

[00:06:34] Alex: to I’m still on eBay. My eBay username is comic pu. , ah, so 

[00:06:39] Brent: I understand what you’re selling.

[00:06:40] Brent: It’s not 

[00:06:40] Alex: Home Furniture. 89.8% positive feedback. One guy gave me negative 

[00:06:45] Brent: feedback. Oh, that’s frustrating. I’ll 

[00:06:47] Alex: say that I, it was for a heat sink that I forgot to include. It was a heat sink and fan that I forgot to include the backplate for, and it got shipped internationally. So the dude within I don’t know why this guy bought it from me, but I ripped it out of an old computer.

[00:06:59] Alex: I upgraded and I got 15 bucks. And the 15 bucks was not worth that one negative feedback to this 

[00:07:05] Brent: day. Yeah, no kidding. My, my experience, so I all, I had a, I used to have a retail computer store. I sold it. I ended up with a ton of inventory that everybody said was bad. I sold it all in eBay. It was amazing.

[00:07:17] Brent: And nothing came back. So anyways let’s keep moving. So e you sold it all on. I sold 

[00:07:23] Alex: everything. This is, you guys made more money on it for some of it. Yeah. This is a, you never 

[00:07:26] Brent: sold it for in the store. It was crazy. Yeah. This was in the nineties, but yeah, some of the 

[00:07:30] Alex: stuff, if you held onto it, it’s probably worth 10 times the amount, if it was like boxed computer games that are, like boxed Sierra games or something.

[00:07:36] Brent: I wish I, I also had a retail store called CD Rom City, so I’m dating myself now. 

[00:07:42] Alex: I update yourself. It’s all good, man. I was there, I was clipping the coupon for Comp U USA on Saturdays going on my gosh, Sundays getting the mail-in. I love that I paid 90 bucks for EDOs, 16 gigs of Ram, and I loved it,

[00:07:55] Brent: So we won’t go into let’s keep moving forward instead. thought it was the best deal. I was so excited. So tell us a little bit about your current Your current store and what you’re doing and is it a hundred percent commerce, e-commerce, I should 

[00:08:07] Alex: say? Yep. It’s a hundred percent e-commerce.

[00:08:10] Alex: Home Perfect is b2c. We have a large database. We have about 250,000 s skews and we have so many different product attributes cuz we have so many different product types. If it’s something like a toilet has a one piece toilet and a two piece toilet, and they might have required accessories that are different.

[00:08:29] Alex: One might chip LTL freight, one might chip X ground. There’s so many different elongated toilets, round toilets. There’s so many different product attributes and attribute sets that cuz of just the breadth of product mix. I felt like I almost had no choice to, to be on Magento. I think Magento has been a good fit for me because of that.

[00:08:49] Brent: Yep. When you were evaluating platforms, did you look at other ones to try to do your store on? 

[00:08:55] Alex: Yeah, so back in 2012, we were on something called the Venda platform. It was software as a service before it was cool, right? Back when it just sucked when it didn’t work. Now Venda was okay, but it got acquired by NetSuite, I think.

[00:09:11] Alex: And at the time we we knew we needed to move to Magenta, so we did. And Magenta one worked very well for us for many years. When it came time to migrating to two, I did debate on whether or not I should move to another option. I had a layout, right? I was like, maybe I’ll go to Shopify, or maybe WooCommerce were the two that I was bouncing around on.

[00:09:33] Alex: But I felt the number of SKUs and the attributes would’ve been an issue on Shopify for me and commerce. I just, as much as I like geeking out I was familiar enough with Magenta that, I have a business to run, at the end of the. I’m the ceo, right? Not cto, right? So as much as I love technology, I need to sell faucets on the internet and toilets, right?

[00:09:51] Alex: How can I just keep the business running while, upgrading the software? I took the plunge to two. It was a little bit rocky at first. I would say the performance for large databases wasn’t there until maybe for me personally, I saw the improvements at two 40 or maybe two 40.

[00:10:08] Alex: But now it is very stable for me. I’m very happy being on it and I’m really finally getting to enjoy all the new technology and new benefits I have of being on it. And I’m having fun with it. So I’m glad now that I made that switch 

[00:10:20] Brent: and I think you’re in a particular market space that has a lot of, like you had mentioned attributes and those are just parts of a product that can ide be identified.

[00:10:30] Brent: And in Magento’s case, they worked also to make configurables and child products. So if you think about on Amazon that left. When you’re navigating, that’s your attributes. Just for our listeners who aren’t under don’t understand the concept the, your particular market is very attuned to having very complicated products that can balloon your skew count.

[00:10:55] Brent: Maybe talk about the challenges of having so many SKUs and. How you’ve worked as a merchant to make customers be able to find the right product when they need to. Yeah. 

[00:11:06] Alex: In short Brent, it sucks. Let’s take for example, the lighting industry. The lighting industry will create, new products and they’ll already have a skew count of 2000 codes, and then they’ll just discontinue on a whim the next year.

[00:11:17] Alex: They might not have even produced some of these things. They just keep throwing stuff out there and put it on. And sometimes the information is so bare from the vendor, but at the same time, we have the information when we when we go on their website. So at the end of the day, I think our customers know what they want.

[00:11:36] Alex: We’re not really looking for the customer who is oh I wanna redo my bathroom or kitchen, but I don’t know what I want. We’re very much looking for people that come into us, the Brandon part. . And when they do, we wanna at least be able to have that brand at part number, that image and offer, ideally a compelling price for them.

[00:11:51] Alex: And we really want them to come to us, not just for one item, but for a whole list. Because we have salespeople that will walk them through a quote and make sure it’s compelling enough. Or we have a members only price club that uses the magenta cart rules to, if they log in a lot of the prices might be heavily discounted and make it compelling for them to use us.

[00:12:08] Alex: So that’s where. We want you to go to a maybe showroom first or maybe discover the product that you want somewhere else, but then come to us for the best deal. Yeah. You mentioned 

[00:12:18] Brent: price rules. Do you have ways to get your average cart value up in, in terms of when they’re navigating through your site, you wanna recommend other products, things like 

[00:12:27] Alex: that?

[00:12:28] Alex: I would say that’s 1000000% credit is given where credit is due to our recommendations, our AI-driven recomme. We analyzed years of sales history and we started with maybe maybe a more dumb AI, if you would call it, right? Just saying, which products were most often purchased with these products.

[00:12:44] Alex: But now that we’ve gotten more information and every sale makes trains that and gets that smarter, we’re now able to maybe use the category data to boost and optimize which related products we show. . It really helps, it, sometimes a customer might come in and say, oh, I, I didn’t know I needed this in-wall tank carrier for this toilet.

[00:13:02] Alex: I don’t know if we personally want that customer, but at least we show it or we show the seat that goes with the toilet or we show maybe a sink and faucet that other customer had purchased. So it’s definitely very detail oriented for us. It needs to be exact and. And we’re not selling a pair of sneakers.

[00:13:19] Alex: Somebody’s not just swapping out their faucet cuz they like a black one one day and a gold one tomorrow. They’re making that investment for a while. 

[00:13:27] Brent: Yeah. And I think recommendations is something that really scales especially as you grow your traffic and as more people, as you start collecting that information for what other customers are doing, that’s where it really comes into play.

[00:13:40] Brent: Do you mind telling us which recommendation engineer you’re using for, you mentioned ai, so are you using a outbound Outbranded one. 

[00:13:49] Alex: Oh, yeah. I’m. I really value the close relationship I have with my host and provider cloud machines.io. I think they specialize in large databases and and large catalogs.

[00:13:59] Alex: And I think in particular they developed the they developed a software called computer ai, which is like product information management and also AI recommendations. I think I was like an alpha partner and now they’re going to market pretty soon.

[00:14:14] Alex: And adding some new clients. So I’m really excited about what they’ve done with me and for them to be able to offer that to other customers. 

[00:14:22] Brent: What would, if you, if somebody were to come to you and say, I’m so afraid of machine learning how would you get, how would you encourage another merchant to embrace the idea of machine learning?

[00:14:33] Alex: I can really say it comes down to cost for us merchants, some solutions are just too costly and I personally can’t sign a contract. I, I. Spend crazy amounts on budget. I have to allocate a certain amount towards ads and I have to stay profitable. I’m not a company that’s looking for I, I looked into you, Brent you said something about how, like you had loss of leaders at your software store, but we’re looking to make money on every order.

[00:15:01] Alex: And, I’m not saying we’re gouging our customers. We’re we’re delivering a competitive price, but we can’t give away these items. We need to we need to make. And if we start spending a lot on very expensive features, we could just kill our whole budget. If somebody is scared about the concept of ai, me personally, if I were to, as somebody who’s probably more computer geek than most business path sorts of people, I would just show them the price and tell them that they have nothing to lose if it’s priced well enough and if it if there’s really no.

[00:15:32] Brent: Yeah, I think I’ve talked to a number of different, say, fraud providers and they use AI to help help with the transactions to make sure, hey, is this a fraudulent transaction, non fraudulent? And always give the example of a client that we had in Mexico who had a call center that would call every single merchant to make sure that it’s the right merchant, right?

[00:15:52] Brent: And at some point that just doesn’t scale anymore. , like you want to fulfill that item. And I think anything that has to do where machine learning can help you as a merchant scale your business, that’s where it works. And Adobe has a sensei, which it’s, it sounds is very similar to what you had in, in your competitor.

[00:16:13] Brent: Do ai. There are so many computer AI or competing to win computers already. . Yes. Computer . Sorry about that computer. Yeah, there’s just so many different places where you can get wins and I think people need to embrace it more. And the other thing is that it has to learn, like it needs to be there.

[00:16:29] Brent: It has to start collecting data, and it has to learn from it, but it 

[00:16:32] Alex: needs, but cost is so prohibitive. Just to use your example of fraud, there’s so many and I see the I see the potential and I see why there’s fraud, fraud companies out there. But me personally, just to, shed some light on what I use for fraud.

[00:16:44] Alex: I have max mine filters, right? And I pay them a very nominal fee per transaction to, allocate thresholds that I’ll then review. And I’ll am I self-insured? Yes. But if I, went with a company that insures me on those frauds too, the cost would just be completely not make sense.

[00:17:01] Alex: So that’s the solution that I did and I put a lot of faith in MaxMind to, to machine learning and catch the frauds for me. But I’ve been very fortunate and very observant and and I like the software and I think that it does work for me, so I was able to keep costs down by doing that.

[00:17:16] Brent: As a medium sized merchant how do you find competing against the big stores like Home Depot or Lowe’s or something like that? Do you find that because you’re so targeted in what you’re doing, that you’re getting, you’re offering a much better value for what the clients are getting, getting?

[00:17:30] Brent: think Home Depot, 

[00:17:30] Alex: Maybe is better for a lot of things. If you came to me and you were like, Hey, I want a new toilet, Alex, and I’m in California. And I’m like, okay, Brent, what toilet do you want? And you’re like, oh, I saw this one at Home Depot. It’s 150 bucks. I would say, go to Home Depot, definitely go to Home Depot and while you’re there, pick off Faucet because that toilet for me to ship to you.

[00:17:50] Alex: If I wasn’t, shipping directly from a west coast fulfillment center, which I can do with Magenta with msi, it’s so expensive to ship something like. I almost don’t even want the sale. It might get damaged and it’s not really a luxury toilet. If you take, for example, the total nere, which is really cool, and it has a integrated heated Bday seat, and I tell everyone, you’re aple.

[00:18:09] Alex: If you don’t have a bday, you gotta have one. That $150 boy doesn’t have that. And it doesn’t have an autoclose lid promised air de odor. It doesn’t have a concealed connection, so you don’t even see the wires. But that total nearest toilet costs 3000 bucks, so it’s different customers and for us, we’re trying to give them the best possible product at a good price.

[00:18:31] Brent: So the niche part of it or the specific market segment that you’re serving serves you well because you’re working on being a targeted, you’re targeting certain types of clients and what you’re doing, and that’s been successful as that’s a good representation. 

[00:18:46] Alex: Yeah. I, all the time and even my father will be like I gotta, I need a new light fixture for a rental place in Brooklyn, and I’ll be like, , let’s go to Home Depot,

[00:18:55] Alex: Let’s go do it, man, this is 150 bucks. They do a great job with lighting, so everyone and or let’s go on Amazon and let’s, let’s find something that, whatever it is, there’s just different customers, like different things, and there’s enough of a market that what we offer is really more granted, luxury.

[00:19:13] Brent: What do you think is the most exciting thing right now in the e-commerce space? What’s getting you 

[00:19:18] Alex: excited about it? I would say personally the amount of ai in terms of recommendations and ways to retarget customers. But I think the costs have finally gotten to the point where it makes sense for someone like me a couple years ago, even something like email marketing platforms.

[00:19:34] Alex: They were so expensive for what you got. And then, value added services of recommendations. It just put me, it’s gonna rock in a hard place cause I value software and I truly understand why it costs that. But I personally, if I just started, buying the best I wouldn’t be able to stay in business how I do it.

[00:19:53] Alex: So I think we’re at like an exciting stage. . Certain things have gotten more complex to pull off, but certain things are also more possible to pull off for less money. So I’m excited to delve deep into that and make it work for me.

[00:20:04] Brent: So you’d mentioned you mentioned email marketing. I’m in a business group and our topic, one of the topics that came up on Tuesday was, people think that social media is gonna be your savior as a merchant. How do you determine how much I should do on Google ads, on, on social media, on, on just an email or a blog post or whatever?

[00:20:24] Brent: How do you break out 

[00:20:25] Alex: different that like a good buddy of mine has silver age comics.com, a site that we helped make on. It’s still on Magenta one, but it works for. And he does a lot of sales on Instagram. We’re selling vintage comics on Instagram and we’ll go live and we’ll have a couple drinks and sell.

[00:20:39] Alex: We sold like a $25,000 low grade copy of the first appearance of the flash on Instagram, which is crazy, and we’ll sell a ton of a hundred dollars books and $50 books, but you get a $25,000 sale on Instagram is nuts. And for him something like social is more important for. , A lot of our customers aren’t really on it that much.

[00:20:58] Alex: They’ll be like, they don’t even really know how to use a computer that well sometimes, or they don’t care, like they just, they know what they want and they want a good price and they know they’re gonna get a tracking number in an email and, so while for this particular business, certain things aren’t embraced in terms of allocating marketing budgets, I would say yeah, there’s more budgeted on Google, right?

[00:21:18] Alex: Or. , but but on other businesses it could be everything.

[00:21:25] Brent: Yeah. Yeah you took the answer out of my mouth. It is specific to businesses and I think as you’re even getting into B2B more, the social aspect of it isn’t as important as. Some of the other channels you have to help market your business. I think that one thing I know Gary Vi always says is, if it’s there, try it.

[00:21:44] Brent: Don’t and test it. Don’t, please don’t. I, 

[00:21:46] Alex: what do you do for testing some? I was talking to ca at the meet magenta after party right before I talked to you, and he was like, Hey man you know who you remind me of, dude? Like you remind me of. And I was like, bro, like I, I please, I’m not, like I’m my own person.

[00:22:01] Alex: And he’s nah, but you probably go to the flea markets and stuff. I’m like yeah. I go to the flea markets and you probably buy a bunch of things. I’m like yeah, I do that. But I just I don’t know. I’m not really the, I very much get a thrill from a from an actual sale, but I’m not gonna like say something more broad.

[00:22:15] Alex: I’m very specific and maybe that just comes. Having more of a technical background as well, 

[00:22:19] Brent: yeah, no I, so what I was gonna say is that testing things and trying things out are always important and I guess going back to social media, how much do you test on those social platforms to see if it’s gonna. Cr if it’s going to bring you some business from those, are they gonna convert to a sale if you did 

[00:22:38] Alex: videos on?

[00:22:39] Alex: Yeah. Probably not for the $4,000 toilet, but maybe for the $300 washlet seat. The thing is you never want to get too comfortable just doing one thing, and you always want to try everything. But sometimes that fear of missing out You get grounded when it’s a grounding feeling when before you know it, you have no more money left than your bank account.

[00:22:57] Alex: So it’s it’s a humbling feeling to be like I have no money to do this. Or and I’m not saying we don’t have the money to do it, I’m just saying, you always need to think from the perspective of maintaining, a profit line. 

[00:23:09] Brent: Yeah. So fear of missing out is a great, it’s a great example.

[00:23:13] Brent: And then also the capacity and the bandwidth to do all those different things you’d like to try. That’s 

[00:23:16] Alex: amazing too, Brent. It’s amazing to not get off the, just to say social media is incredible. The fact that we could go on Instagram at midnight from my friend’s com shop in Queens and get, 200 people in a stream, a hundred people in a stream and have people just buy is such an amazing sort.

[00:23:33] Alex: Feeling like it’s so empowering to be like we just made our own home shopping network, like feeling it with our own, we’re, we’re probably a little bit, we’re cracking jokes and we’re being a little bit Wayne’s worldy, but it’s but the customer likes it too, and that creates like a personal relationship, like I ran into a guy after we did that show, and he was like, yo, man, like you’re the guy.

[00:23:50] Alex: Drinking, like your cup was like it looked like you were drinking a cup of pee, bro. And I’m like, what are you talking about, dude? It was like I think it was like Gatorade , but it’s but the guy was watching, like you had a captive audience and he remembered and he came up to you and it’s and that didn’t cost anything, it was free and it was sincere and it was memorable.

[00:24:06] Alex: So it, depending on what you’re doing, it could be the most important thing. 

[00:24:12] Brent: Do you think as we’re going into the future for content and conversational content the content that’s wrapped around each piece of your products like is if you have a skew that’s one of that $3,000 five toilet writing, $5,000 toilet, sorry.

[00:24:27] Brent: Are, is that content around that? Say you’re writing blog posts or social or whatever, or, yeah, maybe more blog posts that, that’s pointing to that content. Educating people on why that, what’s about that and the features and breaking that content into larger content. It’s totally important. Is that more important now, 

[00:24:43] Alex: what’d you say?

[00:24:44] Alex: It’s totally important. Is that more? Yeah. Yeah. It’s also not our own brand, right? If I had my own private label Washlet, I would be doing even more, at the end of the day, at the end of the day, I have thousands of codes and I get information from vendors and then I can use like a software like computer to get more information from vendors.

[00:25:05] Alex: But I can’t, like I, there’s only so many hours in a day and I can keep going and I can keep adding. And maybe some good reviews help, but I’m a B2C and I’m selling something that people can get in a lot of different places. I think what’s compelling about me is they’re getting a great deal.

[00:25:19] Brent: You mentioned you mentioned having you mentioned b2c. You and you mentioned having the email earlier. And we always hear email is dying or email is dead. Your email list, are they still bringing in good Yes. Returns and do you see email going into the future? 

[00:25:36] Alex: Yes, they’re bringing traffic.

[00:25:38] Alex: I think, you get so many emails every day that they all board together to be like nothing. But you do see traffic and you see like an interesting, sometimes I’ll look at Google Analytics and I’ll be like, man, I sent this email like three months ago. This guy just bought this and it if the more you do, the more you get.

[00:25:54] Alex: Are our emails a little bit spammy? We’re throwing a lot of coupon codes, and are they targeted to an extent? Somebody renovates their house once every few years, ideally you’re trying to get some contractors maybe, or some architects or designers and give them, some sort of incentive to to work with you directly in bulk.

[00:26:09] Alex: But I don’t think it’s going away. . Do you think it’s going away, 

[00:26:12] Brent: Brent? No. I think email’s gonna remain strong. I saw a tweet the other day that we need a spam folder for texting though. And I would say that texting can get super annoying. And I’ve signed up for a couple of different brands for, they say, we’ll text you every once in a while to send you a coupon and then all of a sudden I’m getting a text twice a week.

[00:26:30] Alex: Yeah, I get a text from a gun range. Me and my wife she’s from Texas. We go to near her house’s, like a, there’s an archery range on the second floor and a gun range on the first floor. And we just did archery there like once, and they send me texts. They’re like come to Valentine’s Day at Saddle River Range.

[00:26:46] Alex: Like extra ammo is half price. And I’m like, I like it, but it’s, it’s lost on me. I’m in Brooklyn. Yeah. I’m not going to Saddle River Ranch for 

[00:26:53] Brent: Valentine’s Day. . Maybe that’d be something that you should try this year. 

[00:26:58] Alex: I would definitely do it if I was there. Just shout out to Saddle River Rage guys.

[00:27:02] Alex: The texting’s working guys 

[00:27:03] Brent: keep texting me. Yeah, I read it. I guess the point on the points I’m trying to make is that there is a tipping point email. We don’t want texting to turn, like people say, my texting inbox is something that I, everybody reads the text at some point. 

[00:27:16] Alex: Yeah. Unless it’s five or eight prints from high school.

[00:27:19] Alex: Yeah. . 

[00:27:19] Brent: There you go. The text group that goes around and around. Yeah. I hear ya. Yeah. If you had some kind of nugget to tell a merchant that in it that they should be doing, maybe what they could still do for Black Friday, but then what’s, what they should be doing as they’re planning into quarter one of next year, what would that be?

[00:27:38] Alex: Yeah, so I never do any code upgrades. Right around now I just because, especially with Magento, I’m just like, oh God, I might not realize something else went wrong, for another month. And then it’s a trickle down effect. And then I’m breaking my head on, who knows where, Christmas dinner or Thanksgiving dinner, right?

[00:27:54] Alex: Like just fixing something, which has happened. But like I, I think. , for Black Friday, you just want to get organized and say, what are you doing? What am I gonna do? What are my sales gonna be? Am I offering coupon codes? Make sure the, for us Google promotions are really important.

[00:28:07] Alex: Google ads are really important. Submitting, leaking the coupons and just making sure you know you’re ready because there’s so many things to switch. Weeding up to Black Friday only to then switch it all. , right? Like you’re like, man, I have coupon codes and I’m lowering prices and then I’m activating this and it’s only for this day and then this day and then like once Black Friday’s over, oh my god, cyber Monday.

[00:28:28] Alex: And then, everyone should know Cyber Monday is gonna be extended to Cyber Tuesday, but come that Wednesday, you’re stuck reverting a lot of stuff back. And if you don’t, all your marketing efforts might get mixed up and might cause a trickle down effect of a headache. Just be organized.

[00:28:41] Alex: Yeah. It’s 

[00:28:42] Brent: a plan. Organized, make sure I like that. I I think a lot of people don’t think about the fact that maybe they didn’t turn off their coupon codes after a certain time. And certainly magenta, it’s easy to just make the coupon codes stop working on the day after Cyber Monday or whatever, whenever you want to stop it.

[00:28:56] Brent: Yeah, it 

[00:28:57] Alex: is. But if you don’t do it right it’s like somebody’s adding that extra 5% on something where you only had or it’s just like, oh no and then it’s like, what do you do, as the years go on, it becomes more difficult to like, reach out to the customer and explain to them what you 

[00:29:07] Brent: did.

[00:29:07] Brent: Right. Alex, as I close out, as we finish out the podcast, to give everybody an opportunity to do a shameless plug about anything you’d like to plug. It could be your business or any, anything, your school or something a anything you’d like to plug. What would you like to plug today? 

[00:29:22] Alex: Sure. If you happened to acquired any comic books that’s say 10 cent or 12 cents on the cover price.

[00:29:28] Alex: Maybe some 15. None of that new stuff. Don’t, hit me up and be like, oh, I got these, nineties books. I don’t want ’em one or two of them, but not all of them hit me up. You could even email Alex home perfect.com, Instagram Web seven nyc. I’m born and raised in Manhattan or on eBay at comment palooza.

[00:29:46] Alex: I’m always buying, I’m paying cash for your collectibles. And in particular 1960s Marvel books. I can give you a good deal and I’d love to buy bulk and I buy collections. I buy inheritances. I’ll go anywhere and I’ll come to you. And let’s just, let’s buy these books. I like to keep some of them for myself.

[00:30:02] Alex: I am a collector too, but I do also sell. 

[00:30:05] Brent: Awesome. It sounds like you should also have a online comic. . 

[00:30:11] Alex: Maybe I do. . 

[00:30:13] Brent: That’s awesome. . Alex, thanks so much for being here today. It’s been an enjoyable conversation and I wish you all the best on your your B F C M as they like to say nowadays. 

[00:30:22] Alex: Yeah, but it’s B F C M ct.

[00:30:25] Alex: What is the ct? Black Friday? Cyber Monday. Cyber Tuesday. Extended. 

[00:30:30] Brent: Extended. There you go. And then we’ll call it Christmas in July soon. Yeah. 

[00:30:36] Alex: God. I don’t, I think it’ll just be year round. Honestly, with us it’s always year round. If you join our perfect Members only Price Club and you sign into your account, all the prices are cut in half.

[00:30:44] Alex: So every day is Black Friday at home. Perfect. We’re just trying to get you the best possible deal on your full renovation. 

[00:30:50] Brent: Awesome. I will put all these links into the show notes and I appreciate you being here today. Thank you, Alex. 

[00:30:56] Alex: Thank you, Brent.

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