The Evolving Landscape of SMS Payments with Osa Gaius

How do merchants transition from email to SMS? Osa Gaius walks us through some large issues around regulation and also issues around just understanding as a brand, and how to leverage SMS the right way. We talk about how to not make your consumers upset when you send them communications once or twice a week.

Osa strongly believes that great technology should empower people. This stems from the fact that he grew up in Nigeria with little exposure to computing. That experience has fueled his passion for elegant and useful software products. Osa is the CEO and founder of Parrot, a mobile payment platform bringing customers closer to the businesses they love.


Brent: Welcome to this episode of Talk commerce today. I have Osa Gaius Osa, go ahead and introduce yourself. Tell us a little bit about what you do day to day and one of your passions in life. 

Osa: I’m the founder and CEO of Parrot.

Osa: We are a SMS payments platform that helps merchants collect money directly over text. I got started working at MailChimp and that’s where I really became familiar with e-commerce space. When I’m not working on Parrot and running the company, I spend most of my time making hip hop music and really hiking here in San Francisco.

Brent: That’s awesome. So today we’re gonna talk a little bit about texting and the importance of texting. Why don’t we dive into that? I know that I’ve worked a lot in emerging markets and texting is much more important than it is here. 

Osa: Yeah. Yeah. Spot on. And that’s been my experience before starting Parrot.

Osa: Like I mentioned, I worked at mechi and while at MailChimp, I went back to Nigeria where I grew up as a kid. And that’s where I really got to see exactly what you’re describing, which is merchants and consumers in Africa and in Asia using texting as the primary way to communicate with each. But also to transact and buy and sell goods.

Osa: And so when I came back to the us, what I really tried to focus on was how do American merchants over the next 10 years transition from email to SMS and the biggest challenges there we found were, large issues around regulation and also issues around just understanding as a brand, how to leverage SMS the right way and not make your consumers very upset when you send them communications once or twice a week.

Brent: Yeah, I think you, you keyed in on a really good thing there making him upset because I think people are still well and Americans, anyways, I think C SMS is their private little zone. How do you get around that to help them feel comfortable with getting a SMS message? 

Osa: Yeah, I think the biggest challenge that a lot of

Osa: merchants are gonna have when they try to text consumers, right? Their customers for the first time is making sure that they treat SMS as a sacred channel. I think how you just described it is perfect. A lot of consumers see it as a private space. They see it as a place where their friends and families can communicate with them.

Osa: They don’t see it as an email inbox where anyone in the world, including spamers and fishers and bad actors can get. SMS really feels like where I’m talking to my mom or where I’m talking to my best friend and having a random brand that I’ve never shopped at, or I don’t care about trying to get into my SMS conversation feels like an invasion of privacy.

Osa: It feels like someone’s bothering me. And so what we recommend for brands is think about how you would communicate if you had your best customer in front of you. Like not over an email, not over Instagram, but if you had them literally in front. What would you say to them? What would that conversation look like?

Osa: And we think that if brands start there and if you write down that conversation on a piece of paper and you text it to yourself as a merchant, that’s gonna radically change how you approach your SMS strategy. Because now you think about it as a person, communicating with a person rather than a brand shooting campaigns or dumping advertising into someone’s phone and the brands we work with when they do that, they’re able to leverage SMS in a radically different way, by starting from the human perspective.

Brent: Yeah, that’s a good point. I was on, I was involved in a CRM demo yesterday and it was it was more of a retail CRM. And SMS was a bigger part of that. I would say the only thing, they didn’t really do what I thought they could have done better was to separate out that sacred part of it.

Brent: They did add SMS, just like email. May, maybe you could dive into the differences between email and SMS and maybe some of the reasons around why email seems to be less popular. 

Osa: Yeah. I think one of the biggest challenges of email is, when we started and when I came to America 20 years ago, It was pretty uncommon for businesses to email you.

Osa: It’s a few and far between maybe Amazon was one of the main merchants who would email you back then. But you fast forward 10 years and I’m, out of school I to start working and now there are so many companies like Melham constantly contact Klavio who just specialize in email.

Osa: And the real reason there as you called out is emails seen a massive rise, right? It’s the primary way that businesses choose to contact their customers both before and after they Purchas. And the challenge there has been email is non interactive. And so you’re really treating the email inbox, like a space for advertising, very similar to the actual physical mailbox in your home.

Osa: Like you just, you put stuff in there, businesses put stuff in there and they hope you look at it, it’s not really intended for you to respond to you or even to really interact with, and the challenge with SMS. one out of 10 emails get opened. So you, as a business can be cavalier about what you put in the email, because it really doesn’t matter to be honest, if only one out of 10, people will ever open it.

Osa: But with the challenge of SMS messages is nine out of 10. People will read a text message, you send them. And so while that may be exciting, because you can now put, a discount code in front of them or a sale in front of them, it can also be annoying because nine out of 10 people are gonna see that when they’re driving their kids to work or to school, or when they’re driving to.

Osa: And they have to feel like whatever you put in front of them is gonna be life changing or it’s gonna be exciting. It’s gonna make ’em feel like, Hey I really want to deal with this brand. I want to communicate with them or ideally I want to respond to them. And we think that’s the biggest challenge people are gonna have as they transition for email is.

Osa: Although email open rates are significantly declining. 10% compared to open rates or SMS, which are 90%. We think there’s a bigger challenge if you screw up SMS because a lot more people are gonna see it. And that’s something you, you can’t really recover from 

Brent: that interactive portion of it,

Brent: do you equate that a little bit with how brands will go out on social media? Then they’ll put out a message. People respond to that message, but then the brand never responds back or they don’t interact with that message. Is that a danger that people have with texting that nobody’s gonna come back to them?

Brent: If they do 

Osa: respond? Yeah, we think that’s a major issue that brands have to think about, if email was great because people knew they couldn’t respond, a lot of emails would come from no No So consumers were trained to never interact. Whereas with social media, consumers feel like, yeah, if a brand posts something on TikTok, I should be able to comment.

Osa: And hopefully the brand will get back to me and say, they liked my comment. If I ask for, if I give some review or some feedback, or if I post some user generated content on social media, I expect the brand to engage with me and a lot of brands to your point, just ignore that, right?

Osa: They don’t have anyone to deal with it in the case of SMS. I think a lot of brands are saying if we can interact on social media, we definitely can’t interact over SMS. So let’s just ignore any responses. We get to our text messages and we think that’s a really bad mistake to make. Now you’re training consumers who are used to ignoring your emails to also ignore your text messages, because it’s not a conversation it’s just honestly spam.

Osa: And we think that the right way to approach it is to take a percentage, right? Maybe it’s 20, 30% of your customer care time. The time your support reps would spend on gorgeous or Zendesk, just like dealing with customer feedback and then put those people on SMS conversations, help them, learn how to respond to customers or engage with customers, especially your VIPs.

Osa: Over text, because those are the people who you want to be in a conversation with in real time, especially when you know, there’s an issue with their order when you want their feedback on something, or when you just wanna let them know about something very exciting that’s happening with your business.

Osa: We think that’s the right way to be thinking about SMS, as opposed to treating it like an email inbox where people can expect no responses. 

Brent: Do you think some of the. So I think SMS is fairly common in the financial institutions, at least just to get updates and things like that, but there is no, there, I think they’re pretty explicit as well about saying you can’t reply to this.

Brent: You can reply to say stop, but otherwise this is just a tell you that something’s happening. Does that sort of cloud it for merchants who would like to use it more as an interactive channel? 

Osa: Yeah, I think you raised a gray point around financial institutions. I think those. For me when I went to Nigeria and came back, what I realized was that the financial institutions in the us, particularly the credit card companies and the banks were using SMS the best way, in the sense that when something is wrong, when capital one, for instance needs you to confirm that you indeed trigger a payment on an e-commerce store somewhere or at your car dealership, they’re gonna send you a text and say, Brent, did you actually mean to make this purchase and you as a consumer have to respond one to that text message from bank of America or capital one.

Osa: And we think that’s one of the best examples of interactive transactional texting, right? Because it is a transaction, your bank needs to know whether or not they should treat that thousand dollars charges, fraud or not. Or whether that she let it just happen. And, you can continue on with your day and you’ll notice that when you do reply.

Osa: Yes. Yeah, it was me. I was the one buying the. They’ll always say, great, we’re gonna let the charge happen. Or we are gonna block that charge. Please try again, in five minutes or so. And we think that for a lot of brands, that’s the way to be thinking about, responses from your customers is when you’re texting them, you want them to be able to make something happen in the world.

Osa: By responding to you, whether that’s, getting points or store credit for responding to you with a review, whether that’s confirming yes, they do wanna buy something that was previously sold out. That’s we, that’s the way we think the branch of approaching this is treat it like you’re a bank.

Osa: Like it’s a sacred, very important moment. When you do text someone and they should be able to get value out of it by responding to you. If they can’t get value out of it, by responding to. It starts to feel like you’re bothering them anyway. Whereas in the case of the bank, I’m getting a lot of value, I’m being protected, but I’m also getting to confirm a charge that I want it to actually happen or stop a charge that I did not want to happen. 

Brent: The so the banks versus merchants that may I let’s just say that financial institutions are pretty good at not abusing it, but. my experience with some merchants have been, Hey, sign up, get a 20% discount code for SMS.

Brent: And then pretty soon I’m getting an SMS message every single week for something that I’ve already purchased. And it’s a super annoying, so right away, I’m like, okay, I’m gonna opt out of this list, cuz this is crazy. I don’t need to, I don’t need to get a he phone email every week I bought your headphones, right?

Brent: I’m not gonna buy another pair. There has to be an awareness as well by the brands when to overuse it. 

Osa: Yeah. Yeah. And one of the things we felt longer part about and still think long and hard about is, why do brands abuse it? Cause I think initially our response to brands when they came to us was, no, you can’t use us because we can tell you’re gonna abuse it.

Osa: And we kept asking them, why are you abusing it? What’s missing for you. And I think the first thing that we found was that a lot of these brands. They do email marketing or even SMS marketing, to be honest. Their retargeting is very I’ll use the word non-smart right, because they don’t actually know that Brent has bought the pair of headphones.

Osa: When they’re texting you, they don’t know you bought a pair of headphones when they’re emailing you. They pretend they do right. Cause they have some segment somewhere in Klavio. That’s supposed to indicate that he bought before, but they don’t know what you bought. They don’t care what you. They’re just gonna shove as much stuff into your inbox, which could be your phone or your or your email inbox.

Osa: And they’re gonna hope and pray that you click because the brand, in the case of the performance marketing manager or the, the director of marketing is only tracking click throughs, they don’t actually track. Did Brent open the email and engaged? Did he respond to the email? Did he transact based on the email and that’s unfortunately how they’re treating SMS?

Osa: It was like, we don’t really care what Brett. We just know he bought one time. So he’s more likely to buy again. Let’s just shove, whatever we can in front of him. We hope to God, our click through rates are high. But when we asked the brand if you were the bank if you knew that Brent had a credit card, like right next to him and he could confirm he wanted to buy something from you over email or text, would you still send him the annoying emails?

Osa: And they said, no, of course not. Cuz if I know what Brent bought and he was in a. I wouldn’t sell him a pair of headphones. Again, I would sell him some accessory or some new thing we’ve got. And so I think for a lot of brands, that’s the right way to think about SMS is, it really is one to one.

Osa: You should know what Brent has bought, and you should know what you’re putting in front of Brent at 9:00 AM in the morning. Because if you don’t, then it’s gonna feel like you don’t know what you’re doing as a brand. And Brent is gonna unsubscribe. And we’ve seen that in the data, right? The brands that do SMS.

Osa: Have low unsubscribed rates, the brands who don’t have extremely high unsubscribed rates and SMS ends up not being a good channel for them six months after they start. 

Brent: I think that unsubscribe thing is a great kind of topic to go down. There is rules around or there’s best practices let’s say around email and how often people should get emails.

Brent: It has to be. Even more important to learn and know what this is for SMS. So what is your advice to merchants who are sending and how many you should send and how often? 

Osa: Yeah, so you know, where I’ll of start is by just giving folks an overview of the regulatory landscape.

Osa: There’s really only. Law that matters when it comes to SMS, particularly within the us. And that’s the telephone consumer protection act or the TCP. And a lot of merchants I recommend, go to Wikipedia, just spend maybe a few minutes glancing over the TCPA overview they’ve got there. It’s really good.

Osa: And the thing that’s important about the TCPA is that it highlights a few important rules for merchants, right? Because they, the government in the us knows that people will love to use the phone as a way to get in front of consumers. The first rule a mentions is that you should. Aim to only text consumers between 8:00 AM and PM third time.

Osa: That, that can be difficult if you don’t know where your customer is. If you don’t know where Brent is, you may be emailing or you can be texting him at the wrong time. But 8:00 AM to PM is a general guideline. The second is that unless you have explicit opt-ins so unless at some point you can verify that he, the consumer gave you their phone number and said, yes, I want to get text messages from.

Osa: unless you have that opt in, you have to pay $500 as a fine, for every text message you send for that person. That’s not for every, every time the person says stop, but every time you actually text them. And so those are the kind of two, like regulatory things. You gotta keep in mind. When you start texting us, you gotta have opt in and you really should honor that 8:00 AM to 8:00 PM.

Osa: But the question you’re asking is if I’m honoring those two basic rules, how often should I text people? Some, providers who do SMS marketing and have an incentive to make you text more. We’ll tell you that you should text people twice, three times, four times a week, because that’s mostly what you’re doing over email, right?

Osa: You’re just hitting their email inbox every day or every other day. What we recommend is you actually do not do any of that. You should really only text people at most, twice a month. And the reason we say twice a month is because if you’re texting someone more than twice a month, it means that they’re buying, they intend to buy from you more.

Osa: Twice a month. And if you know that they’re not gonna buy from you twice a month it’s a little weird to text them. Because at that point you’re really just tweeting their inbox, like a spam folder. And it’s not a spam folder. It’s the spam folder is the email inbox. So use that for more heavy weight communication, sales and things like.

Osa: But the real reason you should put a text in front of someone is when you want them to take an action. And that may mean, you’ve got a 50% off sale on your site. Cool. Like we get it. You should text that to everyone, but otherwise you have to really be judicious about what you put in front of people.

Osa: Now, maybe in five years, it’s gonna change because consumers will have a spam folder on their phone as well. That automatically gets silenced. That doesn’t trigger notifications. But until we get there we recommend you treat every communication you send over SMS is mission critical. And that may mean you have to spend extra time on your campaigns and be a little more judicious, but it’s really worth it to do that because nine out of 10 people will read your text message and will be able to ideally take an action.

Brent: The spam folder thing, I think for 20 or 25 years now, people have been saying email market. Or email is gonna die out. Do you think that email marketing is ever gonna die 

Osa: out? Yeah I the interesting thing with regards to email is, for a lot of brands, it still works right. For a lot of brand. It makes a lot of sense, because I think a great example is if you’ve got a hundred thousand people on your email list and you can guarantee. 10% of them will open that email and interact in some way, right? Whether they click through for sale or they click through for restock, that’s not bad if you’ve got a hundred thousand people on your email list.

Osa: And so I think brands who tell us that email is working for them, have a massive email list. Some have a million people on their email list because they’ve just built that email list through various tactics. They might have bought some emails. They’ve got a large list. The challenge in SMS is war.

Osa: SMS is not cheap, right? It costs you money to actually send a message to a consumer. Second, you can’t buy any phone numbers because that’s illegal, right? You can’t buy phone numbers and just start email, start texting those people. And so we think that for brands, it’s gonna take you a while to build a phone number list.

Osa: And so it’s really important to not compare email to SMS in the same way, because you can get away with a lot more over email. You can get away with a lot more spam, right? To be honest, because there are no significant fine. as you would in SMS. And so for brands who think emails working I would, recommend that they think through, okay, if emails working today and it continues to work for another year or two, the real question for you should be if your open rates are around 10, 20% today, can you project out?

Osa: Can you forecast with your open rates are gonna be in five, three years, cuz if you can do that and it holds for you then yeah, you can continue using email and only leverage SNS once in a. But if you know that email is already dying for you, if your open rates are sub 10%, then maybe it’s time to start mixing in other channels and thinking about what are we gonna do when email eventually fades?

Osa: Because it’s not dying tomorrow, but as we can see with gen Z and millennials the open rates continue to decline for those emails. 

Brent: Yeah. And I think it’s from a marketing standpoint, it’s always good to try other channels and test and make sure that it’s working. I do want to pivot a little bit to, we talked a little bit about CRMs.

Brent: I know some, some brands that have done well, or let’s say airlines, some of the airlines have done well with messaging and they’ll move you to SMS and you can talk to an agent directly through SMS talk about how brands can use from a customer service standpoint, their SMS to really get

Brent: better at helping clients. Yeah. 

Osa: Yeah. I think, if you go back to the bank example, when there’s an issue with, a payment it’s very common for capital one or any of the other credit card providers to send you a text and say, Hey was it you, we think that’s a great example of automated customer service, right?

Osa: Because there’s a real issue, if you don’t respond to this. we’re gonna treat whatever happened in the world as fraud, or we’re not gonna treat it as fraud, which is even worse because now we’re letting the charge happen that should have been stopped. We think that’s a great example of customer service because the consumer needs to do something right.

Osa: May take an action and it’s dire it’s mission critical. And in this case, the financial institutions have been able to leverage texting to do that and have been able to automate the texting. Because that way you can happen in real time, a human being doesn’t have to actually message you when there’s.

Osa: And we think that for brands, that’s the right way to think about customer care is what problems are mission critical for your business? What things do consumers need to know about vis-a-vis, their order vis-a-vis a review about your business even, right? What kinds of things are gonna be critical for your business or critical for the consumer and how do you move those away from the email inbox where people might not even respond or might respond late?

Osa: Might not even see. Into a channel where people are gonna say, yeah, I’m ready to solve that problem right now with the brand or I’m ready to respond to the brand. And the immediate things we’ve seen are around customer care. When an order is fundamentally messed up, right? When something’s significantly late, that’s a place where you want to get in front of the consumer as quickly as possible and say, Hey, we’re here,

Osa: we know it’s happening and we’re here to resolve it with. In real time, you can get in touch with us. I think the other approach that we see today brands use is like live chat on the website, which, works it’s okay. The consumer has to log in, find your website, live, chat you and that’s fine.

Osa: The other approach is to have the consumer just email you, and that’s gonna go into your Zend desk. You’re Gorgeous. But we think in the future, a lot of brands will start to look for ways. Leverage SMS is a way to really stand out from the other brands in their category and say, Hey, if you’re a consumer, you can get in touch with us this way, but more importantly, we can help you solve large problems directly over text in a way that you couldn’t over email support or live chat support.

Brent: And I’ll go back to let’s just say Delta airlines has been, especially during the pandemic they’ve offloaded some of their live customer support to texting. And then they usually run you through some sort of a filter to see if you really are going to talk to somebody in real time.

Brent: And then you do end up talking to a real person. And I would imagine that real person is managing probably three or four or five, six queues. So from the merchant standpoint allows you to have more active conversations at once and from the. Client or the customer standpoint, it allows you to feel as though they’re actually hearing you without a bot.

Brent: So I think there is a difference hearing that robot or that AI behind it, Hey, I’m gonna respond and they’re just going to send me some garbage back is there’s no real person there compared to a real person who’s 

Osa: really helping you. Yeah. Yeah. And that’s something we think a lot about at Parrot.

Osa: Parrot. We provide every brand who uses us an AI that can handle some automated customer service kinds of things, but we always make it clear to brands that automating all your customer service is not the goal, especially when you’re in a channel like SMS, because you should let the consumer know, Hey, this is a bot you’re talking to, but there is a human being available, right?

Osa: You can always type human or agent to get right. Really into a conversation with someone because there are some issues. If you imagine hello, fresh in the us here if someone, has an issue with their delivery because their meals got delivered, but it’s all messed up or it’s not refrigerated properly.

Osa: That’s a situation where I want to get in contact with a human being as quickly as possible. I don’t want to go through a bot and have to explain myself. And so we think that mix of automated plus human is gonna be how the best brands stand out over the next 10 years when they’re leveraging SM.

Brent: Yeah. Just tell us a little bit about your company and how it’s solving some of these 

Osa: problems. Yeah. Parrot really is a simple way for brands to collect money directly over SMS. And the reason we focus on collecting money and payments over SMS is because we realize that for a lot of brands, they do not have the infrastructure to do what capital one or bank of America does.

Osa: They can’t go process payments or handle charges over text and for the brands who can do that’s gonna be a superpower in the future. And we’ve already seen some brands like verb energy, like Dirty Lemon which is now part Coca-Cola build infrastructure to collect money over text, because that allows them to provide a radically different customer service experience, but also to get offers and incentives and also campaigns in front of their consumers that consumers can say thumbs up.

Osa: Yes. I want that. A great example would be, Dirty Lemon sells energy drinks, and they use SMS to remind people every 30 days to reorder and they process that reorder directly over text and send consumers a receipt. And so Parrot helps merchants who can’t be capital one. They can’t build that secure, simple way to check out over text.

Osa: We provide that infrastructure for them and we think really that’s the future of SMS, right? It’s going. Spaming people are going beyond spray and prey and really focusing on how do I solve a problem with this customer and then get this customer to transact in the same channel that they were actually having a conversation with me in.

Brent: I think one of the differentiators for let’s say Africa specifically is that you can make payments directly with your SMS provider. Do you think the US is heading in that direction? 

Osa: I think one of the challenges in the us is that the carriers here, the phone carriers, Verizon ATT so on and so forth have not really embraced payment over text as a core part of their business.

Osa: One can argue that’s because, they’re inherently monopolistic right. There are a bunch of reasons why it haven’t. But I think one of the other challenges here is that the banks, right? The Capital Ones the folks who could provide the infrastructure for this kind of thing, Don’t really play nicely with the carriers.

Osa: Whereas in Africa and Asia the phone carriers telecom plays very nicely with financial institutions. And so here in the US, we’ve had to essentially build that infrastructure, that to allow for payments over text. And so at Parrot, we work with the financial institutions on one hand, and we also work with the telecom providers, Verizon ATT to provide us infrastructure to merchants.

Osa: It didn’t exist and it needed to be built, but we think that over the next 10 years, the best brands will leverage this infrastructure that we built. And there will be other folks, right? Like Parrot to help actually solve these problems. But we think it’s the right time to actually go build that.

Osa: That way. If you’re a merchant, you don’t have to go talk to ATT and do this yourself. 

Brent: The whole payment over texting I know. What 10, 10 years ago, or something like that, maybe even still today, you could buy something from a vending machine, over a text. It wasn’t super clunk. It wasn’t super easy, I think now with smartphones, you could, you can do it over apple pay.

Brent: Do you think some of those things are moving in front of SMS for payments, or do you think SMS still has a place that’s more seamless to make those payments at say a vending machine? some local thing. 

Osa: Yeah. Yeah. think brick and mortar is really interesting at brick and mortar, payments where you’re not buying something from a merchant who has no physical presence who has a physical presence.

Osa: So the vending machine being a great example, right? That’s a physical thing that the merchant is set up. Or when you walk into a restaurant and pick up some food they’ve got a physical presence. And so you can either tap your card. If you’ve got one of the contact list cards or you can double tap Apple Pay, just tap your phone.

Osa: We think for a lot of physical purchasing, that’s gonna be the best way. Cuz a lot of folks have really nice credit cards that you can just tap and walk away with with your food or with whatever you are buying. I think the challenge for a lot of merchants who are online though, is that they don’t have a physical presence.

Osa: And so you can’t really just pull out your card from your wallet and tap it to your phone and buy when you’re on online merchant. You can use apple pay if the merchant supports it. But we’ve seen that, a lot of merchants across the internet do not support apple pay.

Osa: Whereas 90% of physical merchants in physical stores do support apple pay. And so we think that there needs to be some in between for merchants to be able to engage you when they don’t have a physical presence think of an online store selling t-shirts they need a way to engage you and get you to transact.

Osa: But unfortunately, Apple pay or a contactless credit card. Isn’t really great in that situation because again you’re on your phone, you’re walking around and your phone isn’t really intended to be a point of sale system. It’s really just a browsing device. And so that, that’s why companies like Parrot will, I think, need to exist for those merchants.

Osa: But the other thing we’ve seen merchants do is actually open up physical locations. Right? Think of Warby Parker, think of brands like that. They just say. Online is too difficult. I’m just gonna go open a physical store because that way I can get that, ease of transacting. People can just walk up, tap a card leave.

Brent: Yeah. And that’s a good point. I went to NRF in New York in January and Amazon had a popup store that had everything in it. You just walk through, get whatever you want. I can’t say that I could buy anything with SMS, but , it certainly was an online in person popup store that that they’d setup

Brent: At the end of every podcast I give the guests a chance to do a shameless plug about anything. You’d. What would you like to plug today? 

Osa: Yeah, I’d love to plug get Parrot. We is our website. If you’re interested in learning more about how to collect payments over text, or if you got conversion problems and you’re trying to solve that in the next 30 to 60 days, please go to and we’ve got a bunch of resources for you to explore there, but also a way for you to get in touch with us and get a demo and learn more about Parrot.

Brent: I’ll put these in the show notes. And how would they get in touch with you 

Osa: through your website? Yeah, the best way to get in touch. Yeah. The best way to get in touch is to Or you can send us an email at, and we’ll get back to you as quickly as possible.

Brent: That’s fantastic. It’s been a great conversation. Thank you so much for being here today. And I look forward to some SMS texting in the future. 

Osa: Definitely. definitely. Thank you for having us.

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